What? No cello playing? I think it’s time for the Bamster to go all in with the OWS guys.

The longer these hippie-wannabes keep getting ignored by everyone but the HuffPost and the Daily Kos, they’re gonna get bored and frustrated and they’re gonna lash out just like this more and more.

Finally we’re getting the rubber bullets….and in Denver of all places. Bring on the water canon!

Did anyone else notice how the UP report was slanted to make it look like it was all the police’s fault?

That is always the way, TLM. Paint the police as minions of the fascist big-monied interests. Doesn’t matter if it is true or not, because the people who read the HuffPo for news will believe it anyway.

Useful idiots!

Looks like some English Christians are about to help the poor and unemployed….. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/oct/29/christians-defend-occupy-london-protest

How are people camping without permits and without basic sanitation on public or private property “helping the poor and unemployed”? A significant feature of the “Occupy” movements in this country and elsewhere is that they have no clear objectives or policy demands. In New York and in other places they not only aren’t helping the poor (except for some homeless who come to eat the food, to which the Occupiers are beginning to object), they are hurting the poor by taking police time and attention. Crime is up at the camping sites and elsewhere in these cities.

Katherine. Where in the First Amendment is the requirement for a license for free assembly or petitioning the government.

Large gatherings in public spaces are governed by local ordinances. This is a reasonable requirement since the local government must arrange for police coverage, especially if a counter-protest is in view. Cities and towns also often require protesters to pay fees to cover the costs of extra police protection and clean-up. Tea Party-style protests in the last couple of years have applied for permits and paid the required fees — and cleaned up after themselves, too. The Richmond Tea Party is asking for a refund of $10,000 it paid, since “Occupy Richmond” is being charged nothing at all. Nobody is preventing these young people from assembling or from petitioning the government. They claim the right, however, to take over public spaces to the exclusion of other members of the public and on terms that violate reasonable regulations to keep the spaces accessible, clean, and safe. They can “assemble” every day under the usual rules which prevent sleeping in the park, and they can “petition” by sending letters, sending emails, or visiting and calling the offices of the public officials they want to talk to. This latter item would require them to develop and actual agenda of policy demands, something they haven’t done yet.

Actually, I tend to agree with your idea that if I want to march around city hall with a protest sign I should be able to do so, as long as I don’t impede access for other citizens on the sidewalks and on the streets. In most places I think citizens are able to do this, unless they are outside an abortion mill, in which case their rights are unreasonably restricted. When the gathering of First Amendment exercisers is large issue of access and safety come into play.

And, John, I note that you are unable to say how the St. Paul’s protestors are “helping the poor and unemployed.”

Your right Katherine. The poor and unemployed have know chance of defeating large and wealthy corporations and their hand picked legislators. They should just give up.
I know certain local authorities claim they have the right to restrict assembly. They did so for many years against minority civil rights.
Is only the 2nd amendment important to conservatives?

John: These ‘poor and unemployed’ people are backed by millions of dollars in donations from assorted left-wing pressure groups, without which they would long ago have gone home owing to lack of supplies. When genuinely poor people, the local homeless, show up at OWS sites, they are beginning to be turned away and refused food or access to shelter.

Meanwhile, I should like to point out that this is utterly priceless:

large and wealthy corporations and their hand picked legislators

Show me where in any country’s constitution the vote is given to corporations and not to individual citizens. Then explain to me the existence of labour and social-democratic parties in every democratic country except the U.S., and how ‘large and wealthy corporations’ have ‘hand-picked’ their legislators. Unless, of course, by ‘corporations’ you mean public- and private-sector unions, which do indeed often hand-pick candidates for labour parties and contribute their members’ dues (confiscated by legal force) to those parties’ campaign funsds.

Ah, but only the U.S. is real, you say? Then please explain away the long and intimate history of connection between the AFL-CIO, SEIU, and other labour bodies and the Democratic Party. Extra points if you can fudge Mr. Obama’s (so far undelivered) promise to do away with secret ballots for union certification, so that union organizers can bully workers into their protection racket one by one.

As the hand-picked legislators of many large and powerful corporations (and labor union corporations, as Jay Random ably points out) and their leaders are Democrats, I wonder that you object, John.

Let a large group gather near your place of residence making loud noise at all hours of the day and night, obstructing your access to your favorite park and your favorite lunch spot, and depositing trash and human urine and excrement on sidewalks and doorsteps where you live, and tell me you won’t object because they should have their “First Amendment rights” to trash your neighborhood.

Democratic Republics are sometimes messy but they are better than any other form of government.

John, do tell us how the “occupy” movement is going to help the poor and unemployed? Would love to know!

John,

Nobody is stopping Occupy Richmond. The problem is that they are being favored by the mayor because he is from the civil rights movement. He like them more than he likes the Tea Party, so he requires only the Tea Party to follow the law about protest meetings. Occupy Richmond doesn’t have to.

John, there is “mess” and there is “filth.” The mess is generally spoken of as metaphorical with deals and compromises being the “mess.” “Occupy [Wherever]” is now in ever so many places living in filth, the kind that can easily cause disease.

And of course we are all still waiting breathlessly for you to tell us how the Occupy groups are helping the poor and unemployed.

No one is stopping Occupy Springfield (Illinois) either… because they are trying a really radical tactic: having genuinely peaceful, orderly, and time limited demonstrations where everyone GOES HOME afterward and does NOT leave a mess behind.

Two weeks ago they conducted a march through downtown that was about as threatening as a Christmas parade. Everyone stayed on the sidewalk and obeyed the traffic signals and no one got arrested or threatened anyone. Yesterday they did their “occupy your state capitol” thing which consisted of a small group of people holding signs out in front of the capital for about, maybe, 2 hours at most. Everyone involved in both demonstrations appeared to be clean, mentally stable, and well mannered. Maybe it’s that small-town Midwest niceness vibe or something they have going for them…

A significant feature of the “Occupy” movements in this country and elsewhere is that they have no clear objectives or policy demands

Completely false and, indeed, a very dangerous falsehood! The OWS protests have very clear objectives:

1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.

10. Free education for all children in public schools. Combination of education with industrial production, &c, &c.

Bring on the water canon!

You’ll need more than water canon: AC130s, perhaps, or General Winter may fight on your side. Otherwise, especially in D’RAT states, you can’t expect the police or national guard to deal with these economic terrorists, and the Army and Marines will be off limits until Cain mobilizes them 2013.

If the Tea Party want to Reclaim America from the OWS, they’ll have to do it themselves — and it’s pretty clear they will!

Ladies and Gentlemen,

If your first response to someone is avoided rather than being directly answered, and you notice a lack of sound reasoning and factual basis (and a certain odor of straw) please don’t make the mistake of expecting that subsequent answers from the same source will be any more substantial or enlightening.

Just a thought.

Bill(not IB) -

i had noticed that trend, which is why I refrained from feeding the unresponsive trolls.

Did any of you read the article in the Guardian that I referred to? It reports that religious groups are going to surround the protesters to protect them from the police. That is the ‘help’ I mentioned.
I assumed that the protesters were poor and unemployed because it would be difficult to work and occupy at the same time.
What are your thoughts on religious groups helping the St Paul’s occupiers. I see that two priests have resigned from the staff of St Paul’s in protest against the handling of the protesters

You assumed things not in evidence. And it is no surprise that leftist religious activists turn out to help leftist political activists. If the protestors were obeying laws they would be in no danger of arrest.

John, you also assume the protesters are poor and unemployed. Neither seems based on evidence. Wall street occupiers seem to be mostly rich kids well bankrolled, with expensive tents and sleeping bags. It’s merely hte cause du jour.

“The poor and unemployed have know chance of defeating large and wealthy corporations”

John, just what do you define as “poor”? The left has redefined poor, so that most of the so called poor in this nation own a home, have air conditioning and heating and at least one car. They are not “poor” in the sense of an inhabitant of a third world nation.

So your cause seems to be more about envy than about real need. Also I notice you do not frame the question in terms of who is in the right, or who is to blame. You frame it in terms of “defeat” as if right and wrong did not figure into it at all.

You seem to think that right and wrong is determined by your self indulgence and envy, and that ought to justify theft on your part. Do you not see how that has always led to disaster in the past, and that it can never work? You will end up supporting a demagogue that will merely use your ire and stupidity to rise to power. You still won’t succeed in getting what you want. Haven’t you studied history at all?

You are like a whining adolescent trapped in old man’s body. How can you have let the leftists trap you into this arrested state of thinking your whole life? Why didn’t you ever think that the reason for this situation might have been in some part due to your choices?

Democratic Republics are sometimes messy but they are better than any other form of government.

Does the concept of inalienable rights figure in at all to your philosophy of government? Do you think that any freedom or right can be abrogated as long as the “majority” vote to remove it? Again, that won’t get you what you want. Such movements end up being co-opted by dictators who tell you what you want to hear. And people like you are always gullible enough to go chasing after them, never learning your lesson.

Speaking of free assembly – in one city, the Tea Party is filing a complaint and asking for a refund of their $10,000.00 fee paid to that city for a permit to hold a protest in the parks, since the Flea Party has not paid anything to ‘occupy’ the same areas for an indefinite time.

Fair is fair.

I hope some tax payers will start protesting the USELESS expense of the Occupy protests and demand that laws be passed limiting the time for protests and prohibiting ANYONE from camping in public and private parks, disrupting the public peace after 9pm, etc.

That is – “protesting the USELESS AND EXHORBITANT expense of the Occupy protests” costing the taxpayers MILLIONS of dollars!

(Just like ol’ Giles Fraser costing the CoE big bucks by closing St. Paul’s.)

Political drama is expensive – but the leftists expect for the tax payer to foot the bill…of course. They feel entitled to pick the public pockets.

Ann Coulter says the last and only other place the Occupy protestors have ever occupied was Mom’s basement.

Most of these people are generally undesireables and unemployable because they are addicted to one thing or another and have a bad attitude to boot.

No sane business owner would want to hire them.

John seems to me to be a naive innocent rather than a troll. I have been reading a lot on Germany in the 1930′s, and it is quite apparent that it was naive innocents, including the Lutheran Church, that were swayed by fine sounding rhetoric and allowed the takeover of their country by a gang of thugs. The strategy of fomenting civil unrest, even imitation civil unrest, is taken straight out of Marx. It is no coincidence that the Occupy movement is organized by Soros subsidized groups such as MoveOn, Acorn, SEIU, and various “community organizers.” These Marxists are not going to go away. They will attempt to create chaos year after year under one name or another until they succeed in a power grab. I think they thought they had success within their grasp with the accession of Obummer, but the country isn’t convinced. The naive, well meaning innocents play right into their hands.

Check out the list of Occupy Wall Street supporters.

The list shows who Obama’s ‘birds of a feather’ really are.

Maybe it has a positive side after all: what other movement could unite Black Panthers and David Duke?

Come on, guys *group hug*

“Most of these people are generally undesireables and unemployable because they are addicted to one thing or another and have a bad attitude to boot.”

Actually, Chris nailed it best earlier this week in
LIZZIE DOES MANHATTAN: “…if you were dumb enough to major in women’s studies, art history or semiotics.” and THE INTERSECTION OF THE PASTORAL AND THE PROPHETIC: ” …a doctorate in applied linguistics” because underlying much of this discontent is the assumption that they’re owed something.